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Hull City Forum >> CI Football Plus >> Human behaviour , Tax bombshell ends 'principled purchases'
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candw

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#16
12/07/2017 at 13:32

Quote Quote by exiled CITY AFC on 12/07/2017 at 13:11
Is that the emissions at point-of-use science or the whole carbon cycle science? - I.e. including making the two cars and all their components plus the energy that will be needed to power them both for 7 years.


Are you publicly admitting to being unable to show the costs yourself? At point of reading, of course!

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exiled CITY AFC

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#17
12/07/2017 at 15:16

I have no dog in this fight all of our 'daily use cars' do way more than the 'break-even' 29mpg that your links reference in their science and for good measure my shell app does carbon offset for all my fuel used anyway (100%) so my green halo is fine.

The other cars we own will never end up in land-fill and only do very very small mileages per year so are not even static on the scale compared to the 8million Volkswagens produced per year.

Currently unless you are getting <29mpg it's not worth bothering about. Drive it till it breaks then worry about going electric.  

Let it never be said that I was silent when they needed me - William Wilberforce 

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essexgull

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#18
12/07/2017 at 16:02

Quote Quote by exiled CITY AFC on 12/07/2017 at 13:11
Is that the emissions at point-of-use science or the whole carbon cycle science? - I.e. including making the two cars and all their components plus the energy that will be needed to power them both for 7 years.


I don't know the figures - we are still in the first generation phase of actual electric cars on the road, so I'm sure that the green credentials are somewhat negated by the build effect, but that will be improved upon immensely in future generations. I compare it to the smartphone technology we have now with the iPhone 3 in 2007. First gen phase is always the big initial cost to get into production, then future gens perfect and advance it - it's impossible to jump the generations without seeing the popularity and economic potential.

Green electricity from wind power, solar power and water power is going to boom with the development of the huge batteries being developed, which will moderate the frequency and output of the grid, so apart from the initial build, there could soon be a zero-carbon travel system. All good news.


EG 

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exiled CITY AFC

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#19
12/07/2017 at 16:09

I think it will take a lot longer than you imagine without some manipulation of the market to make it move faster. There is a reason WHY we are not driving electric cars now and it's not just the simple green case. I have personably done work that now makes onshore wind viable without a subsidy but we didn't get called in to help UNTIL Cameron took the subsidy away. Now it's can be done with a margin so it's viable and viable in volume. Storage was never a problem it's the batteries that are needed to store electricity that are. Anyway range extending diesel / petrol hybrids will be the way for most but don't forget physics no energy comes for free.  

Let it never be said that I was silent when they needed me - William Wilberforce 

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essexgull

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#20
12/07/2017 at 16:22

NorthConnect goes into direct production next year, which will mean that an increased percentage of UK electricity will be coming from water power, which apart from the build and cabling, is as renewable as it can get.

The problem for the UK is that the EU has been acting as the 'exchange' for these large developments - the legal, commercial and political cooperation aspects. Will the UK be able to replace the paper structure to continue the move to renewables? We shall see.. at the moment, the UK seems to be arguing amongst itself what words can be used, what colour a commercial judge should be for an inquiry and other completely nonsensical national debates, rather than the important groundbreaking issues.

EG 

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exiled CITY AFC

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#21
12/07/2017 at 16:54

The planet earth always has a way of showing us that there is no such thing as free - we don't yet know the full extent of the 'unknown unintended consequences' of green energies yet. Remember when nuclear energy would be so cheap it was not worth metering and yet now 10k plus people are employed costing billlions for not even half clearing up at windscale. What will likely happen is energy supplies as always will become targets for war and terrrorism and that is likely to increase the pressures and costs of green energy. I was at a talk recently where it was suggested future wars may be fought over water...

We are BTW in the third age of electric vehicles the first age was in the innovation rich pre-ford era, the second great electric hope gave us the milk float and some niche vehicles but little more - this maybe a new era but I doubt it. There needs to be a great leap in more of the current model - the battery advances are notable but nowhere near enough to create a new epoch  

Let it never be said that I was silent when they needed me - William Wilberforce 

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essexgull

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#22
14/07/2017 at 15:30

Once electric cars hit a certain ownership level, many petrol stations will start becoming uneconomical and close down, which together with battery improvements and faster charging ability, will switch range anxiety onto fossil fuel car owners, pushing them into electric ownership. The ownership graph will be exponential and we're in stage one of the ownership epoch. I don't include Clive Sinclair's car in this.


EG 

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The Prince of Munster

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#23
14/07/2017 at 18:41

The charging issue is massive. At the moment it's relatively easy to drive across Europe, stopping every 400-800 miles for fuel - which takes minutes - depending on your car's petrol/diesel usage.

You can't do that with electric because it takes hours to "re-fuel". 

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candw

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#24
14/07/2017 at 19:06

It must change to a quick "battery swap"; 2 minutes and away.

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exiled CITY AFC

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#25
15/07/2017 at 01:41

The battery is the floor of these cars - no so easy to swap than in your flesh light.  

Let it never be said that I was silent when they needed me - William Wilberforce 

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candw

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#26
15/07/2017 at 09:22

The battery is the floor of these cars - no so easy to swap than in your flesh light

Naturally?

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exiled CITY AFC

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#27
15/07/2017 at 11:01

Quote Quote by essexgull on 14/07/2017 at 15:30
Once electric cars hit a certain ownership level, many petrol stations will start becoming uneconomical and close down, which together with battery improvements and faster charging ability, will switch range anxiety onto fossil fuel car owners, pushing them into electric ownership. The ownership graph will be exponential and we're in stage one of the ownership epoch. I don't include Clive Sinclair's car in this.
EG

Will never happen whilst Tesla are following their stupid strategy - they should be building a 'peoples' electric car preferably appealing to today's kids and 'just about old enough to drive'. Instead they insist on making cars for the hardest part of the market to satisfy...

Honda, Ford, Austin, Agnelli, Hitler (VW) have all shown him the way but he knows best... 

Let it never be said that I was silent when they needed me - William Wilberforce 

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candw

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#28
15/07/2017 at 15:52

Sounds pretty interesting.

Which one of these guys flies rockets as well? Honda, Ford, Austin, Agnelli, Hitler (VW) have all shown him the way but he knows best...  

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exiled CITY AFC

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#29
15/07/2017 at 19:55

We have had numerous attempts at on-demand driving clubs in our city - all have failed so far. Über is just easier and cheaper. When Uber has self driving cars they can worry about if they are electric or not... 

Let it never be said that I was silent when they needed me - William Wilberforce 

29 posts. < 1 2 > Show 15 30
Hull City Forum >> CI Football Plus >> Human behaviour , Tax bombshell ends 'principled purchases'